日据时代对一个韩国家族来说意味着什么
My Family’s Shrouded History Is Also a National One for Korea
译文简介
日据时代对一个韩国家族来说意味着什么
正文翻译

I first learned about the decades-long Japanese occupation of Korea in 1985, when my grandfather told me he still dreamed in Japanese. “Granfy’s first language,” he said
我是1985年才第一次了解日本曾占领朝鲜半岛长达几十年。那天,祖父告诉我,他做梦时仍然会用日语说梦话。“日语是祖父的第一语言。”


My grandfather’s dreams were just one legacy of the Japanese occupation government’s 35-year colonization program, intent on assimilating Koreans culturally and politically, erasing their language, history and culture. Naisen ittai — “Japan and Korea as one body” — treated Koreans as the lost sibling race to the Japanese, reclaimed to be re-educated.
我的祖父用日语说梦话,只不过是日本统治朝鲜半岛35年实行的殖民政策的遗产之一,日本曾想在文化和政治上同化朝鲜民族,抹去他们的语言、历史和文化。日本帝国曾宣扬“日韩一体”——把朝鲜人当作日本失散的兄弟民族重新认领回来,接受再教育。
我的祖父用日语说梦话,只不过是日本统治朝鲜半岛35年实行的殖民政策的遗产之一,日本曾想在文化和政治上同化朝鲜民族,抹去他们的语言、历史和文化。日本帝国曾宣扬“日韩一体”——把朝鲜人当作日本失散的兄弟民族重新认领回来,接受再教育。

Many historians cite the so-called modernization of Korea by Japan as the reason for Korea’s postwar prosperity, but the Japanese police, factories and trains were designed only to more easily take Korean timber, rice, fish, coal and cotton to Japan. And the Korean people, too: by August 1945, hundreds of thousands of Koreans had been forced to fight in the Japanese Army, work in their factories, or in the case of the Korean so-called comfort women, forced into sexual slavery.
许多历史学家认为,日本所谓的日治朝鲜时代是韩国战后繁荣的原因,但日本的警察、工厂和火车只是为了方便把朝鲜的木材、大米、鱼、煤炭,棉花还有朝鲜劳工运到日本。到1945年8月,成千上万的朝鲜人被迫加入日本陆军,在他们的工厂里工作,或者像所谓的朝鲜慰安妇那样,被迫成为性奴。
许多历史学家认为,日本所谓的日治朝鲜时代是韩国战后繁荣的原因,但日本的警察、工厂和火车只是为了方便把朝鲜的木材、大米、鱼、煤炭,棉花还有朝鲜劳工运到日本。到1945年8月,成千上万的朝鲜人被迫加入日本陆军,在他们的工厂里工作,或者像所谓的朝鲜慰安妇那样,被迫成为性奴。
On Aug. 14, 1945, just over a week after the bombing of Hiroshima, the Korean police announced that Emperor Hirohito would address the public on the radio at noon the next day. The emperor had never once addressed the public. His Aug. 15 recorded speech announced that Japan was accepting the Potsdam Declaration, effectively surrendering. His phrasing was so vague, and his language so formal, though, that the Koreans who did hear the speech had to effectively infer their liberation. The speech never once mentioned the country’s name.
1945年8月14日,在广岛被轰炸的一周后,朝鲜警方宣布裕仁天皇将于次日中午通过电台向公众发表讲话。日本天皇此前从未向公众发表过演说。裕仁天皇在8月15日的录音讲话中宣布,日本将接受《波茨坦公告,实际上是宣布投降。然而,他的措辞是如此含糊,语言是如此正式,以至于听过他这段演讲的朝鲜人只能推测他们已经得到了解放。但讲话中完全没有提到韩国这个国家的名字。
1945年8月14日,在广岛被轰炸的一周后,朝鲜警方宣布裕仁天皇将于次日中午通过电台向公众发表讲话。日本天皇此前从未向公众发表过演说。裕仁天皇在8月15日的录音讲话中宣布,日本将接受《波茨坦公告,实际上是宣布投降。然而,他的措辞是如此含糊,语言是如此正式,以至于听过他这段演讲的朝鲜人只能推测他们已经得到了解放。但讲话中完全没有提到韩国这个国家的名字。
On the afternoon of Aug. 16, the Kyungsung Broadcast Station carried a very different radio broadcast, from An Jae-hong, a Korean independence movement leader, who invited Koreans to “meet our day of light.” Aug. 15 is now Gwangbokjeol, “Return of Light Day,” one of the few holidays observed in both North and South Korea. In the joint celebration resides some hope of celebrating it one day together, as one country.
8月16日下午,京城放送局播送了一段截然不同的广播,朝鲜独立运动领袖安在鸿表示,要朝鲜人“迎接我们的光明之日”。8月15日成了光复节,即“回归光明之日”,这是朝鲜和韩国共同庆祝的少数节日之一。在联合庆祝中,还保留着有朝一日朝韩作为一个国家共同庆祝的希望。
8月16日下午,京城放送局播送了一段截然不同的广播,朝鲜独立运动领袖安在鸿表示,要朝鲜人“迎接我们的光明之日”。8月15日成了光复节,即“回归光明之日”,这是朝鲜和韩国共同庆祝的少数节日之一。在联合庆祝中,还保留着有朝一日朝韩作为一个国家共同庆祝的希望。
The end of the occupation and Naisen ittai left behind many Koreans who had never been taught Korean, at a loss for knowing only Japanese. When some tried to make their own Korean flags to wave in celebration, they could not remember the exact way to render it; others had their flags, kept hidden for many years. Publishing houses even lacked for Korean language typesets. The country undertook a vast educational project to undo the one it had suffered through. Dafna Zur’s “Figuring Korean Futures” outlines some of this cultural re-education effort, post-colonization, conducted in children’s literature. I wept after reading that the first issues of Chugan Sohaksaeng, a popular post-colonial children’s magazine, had articles on Yi Sun-shin and his dragon-headed ships, the global superiority of the Korean language, and Seokguram’s defaced Buddha — a more or less exact outline of that 1985 trip to see my grandfather.
日据的结束和日韩一体让许多从未学过朝鲜语、只会日语的朝鲜人不知所措。一些人试图制作自己的朝鲜国旗挥舞庆祝,但却不记得标准的制作方法;还有一些人手里有藏了很多年的国旗。出版社甚至没有朝鲜语的排印字模。
这个新生的国家着手进行了一项大规模的教育计划,以弥补曾经遭受的损失。达夫娜·祖尔 的《找到朝鲜未来》一书概括了,韩国在后殖民时代对儿童文化再教育的一些努力。
读完最初印刷发行的几期《小学生周刊》,我哭了,这是一本后殖民时代韩国流行的儿童杂志,里面写了李舜臣和他的龙首船,朝鲜语的优越性,以及石窟庵被破坏的大佛——这些差不多就是1985年我去探望祖父的那次旅行的总结。
日据的结束和日韩一体让许多从未学过朝鲜语、只会日语的朝鲜人不知所措。一些人试图制作自己的朝鲜国旗挥舞庆祝,但却不记得标准的制作方法;还有一些人手里有藏了很多年的国旗。出版社甚至没有朝鲜语的排印字模。
这个新生的国家着手进行了一项大规模的教育计划,以弥补曾经遭受的损失。达夫娜·祖尔 的《找到朝鲜未来》一书概括了,韩国在后殖民时代对儿童文化再教育的一些努力。
读完最初印刷发行的几期《小学生周刊》,我哭了,这是一本后殖民时代韩国流行的儿童杂志,里面写了李舜臣和他的龙首船,朝鲜语的优越性,以及石窟庵被破坏的大佛——这些差不多就是1985年我去探望祖父的那次旅行的总结。

My grandparents had met in Goheung, on the southwestern coast, in elementary school, each born during the first years of the occupation. My grandmother admired my grandfather for standing up to his teacher at school, insisting on the importance of ancestor worship for Koreans — something I had heard before, but now know could have sent him to jail or cost him his life. My grandfather began as a young fisherman, selling his catch at a market held on boats in the open ocean, before learning he could study fisheries at university.
我的祖父母是在朝鲜西南海岸的高兴郡读小学时认识的,他们都出生在日据朝鲜时代的头几年。祖母很钦佩祖父,因为他在学校敢于反抗老师,坚持认为祖先崇拜对朝鲜人很重要——我以前听说过,但现在才知道这么做可能会让他进监狱或者送命。祖父最初是个年轻渔民,在海上的露天市场出售他的渔获,后来他在大学学习渔业。
我的祖父母是在朝鲜西南海岸的高兴郡读小学时认识的,他们都出生在日据朝鲜时代的头几年。祖母很钦佩祖父,因为他在学校敢于反抗老师,坚持认为祖先崇拜对朝鲜人很重要——我以前听说过,但现在才知道这么做可能会让他进监狱或者送命。祖父最初是个年轻渔民,在海上的露天市场出售他的渔获,后来他在大学学习渔业。
August 1945 found them living near Sinuiju, in North Pyongan Province, along the border with China, just north of Pyongyang, where he had been assigned to work as a civil servant in a fisheries laboratory run by the colonial government. He casually noted that his Japanese superiors represented his work as their own. He smuggled rice, as the ration was too small to feed his family. Even when they had almost no food, he bragged about my grandmother’s skill at cooking.
1945年8月,他们生活在平安北道的新义州市,位于平壤以北,与中国接壤,他被分配到殖民政府的渔业实验室当公务员。他时不时发现自己的日本上司把他的工作成果据为己有。,因为口粮配给太少,无法养活家人,他走私过大米。即便是几乎没有食物的时候,他也会夸赞祖母的厨艺。
1945年8月,他们生活在平安北道的新义州市,位于平壤以北,与中国接壤,他被分配到殖民政府的渔业实验室当公务员。他时不时发现自己的日本上司把他的工作成果据为己有。,因为口粮配给太少,无法养活家人,他走私过大米。即便是几乎没有食物的时候,他也会夸赞祖母的厨艺。
After learning of Japan’s defeat on the radio, he rushed home and told my grandmother they had to go south immediately. “The Soviet Army entered Sinuiju at the end of August,” he wrote of his country’s division at the 38th Parallel between the United States and the Soviet unx.
当从收音机里得知日本战败后,他急忙赶回家,告诉祖母他们必须立即南下。“苏联军队将于8月底进入新义州,”他的国家将在美国和苏联之间的三八线上分裂。
当从收音机里得知日本战败后,他急忙赶回家,告诉祖母他们必须立即南下。“苏联军队将于8月底进入新义州,”他的国家将在美国和苏联之间的三八线上分裂。
He obtained permission for a “business trip,” and my grandparents left with their children on a 12-ton boat named the Gipungwhan — a fishermanTogether they passed safely down the coast, past the Communists, surviving a storm that nearly sank the boat before finally arriving at Incheon harbor. U.S. forces met them and directed them to take the train — free, he observed — to Seoul.
他获得了“出差”的许可,我的祖父母就带着孩子乘坐一艘名为“渔人”的12吨船离开了
他们一起顺海岸安全而下,途中遇到过..党人,在一场几乎导致沉船的风暴中幸存,最终抵达仁川港。美军接待了他们,并指示他们乘坐火车前往首尔——火车费用是免费的。
他获得了“出差”的许可,我的祖父母就带着孩子乘坐一艘名为“渔人”的12吨船离开了
他们一起顺海岸安全而下,途中遇到过..党人,在一场几乎导致沉船的风暴中幸存,最终抵达仁川港。美军接待了他们,并指示他们乘坐火车前往首尔——火车费用是免费的。
There are little mysteries I understand differently now, all these years later. Visits to my family in Korea often meant dinners where I would be told, always, what we were eating, no matter how many times they’d seen me eat it before. The Korean-American habit of quizzing one another — When was the last time you were back in Korea? Do you speak Korean? Do you read it? What food can you make? — now feels to me like the drills of people studying for a more Korean future than the one they had had.
多年之后的今天,作为韩裔美国人的我,对韩国的传统习俗和生活细节已经不甚了解。每当我去韩国看望我的家人,我总会在晚宴中被告知我们正在吃什么食物,不管我们以前曾经吃过多少次这些食物。其他韩国家庭也是这么做的。
韩裔美国人都有互相盘问的习惯——你上次回韩国是什么时候?你会说韩语吗?你会读吗?你会做什么韩国菜?——现在我觉得,这就像人们在不停地练习,只为在未来继续保持和铭记自己的韩人身份和文化。
多年之后的今天,作为韩裔美国人的我,对韩国的传统习俗和生活细节已经不甚了解。每当我去韩国看望我的家人,我总会在晚宴中被告知我们正在吃什么食物,不管我们以前曾经吃过多少次这些食物。其他韩国家庭也是这么做的。
韩裔美国人都有互相盘问的习惯——你上次回韩国是什么时候?你会说韩语吗?你会读吗?你会做什么韩国菜?——现在我觉得,这就像人们在不停地练习,只为在未来继续保持和铭记自己的韩人身份和文化。
And the more openly didactic qualities of my visits with my grandfather — always being told that Korean culture or language was superior, for example, which once felt to me like his way of chiding my father for leaving for the United States and not teaching us Korean — I now understand as the act of a man who still woke from dreams in Japanese, who had lived to see a future where his son, also born during the occupation, could decide not to live in the country once lost to them, could decide not to teach what was once forbidden for them to learn. And his grandson might never know.
以前,每当祖父对着我喋喋不休地讲述朝鲜文化或朝鲜语言的优越性时,我总觉得他是在责备我父亲去了美国,并且不教我们韩语——我现在明白了,我的祖父作为从日据时代一路走来地人,看着他同样出生在日据时代的儿子,离开了这个他们曾经失去的国家,不向下一代教授他们曾经被禁止学习的东西(韩语)。他会感到十分的痛心,然而他的孙子们可能永远都不会理解他的心情。
以前,每当祖父对着我喋喋不休地讲述朝鲜文化或朝鲜语言的优越性时,我总觉得他是在责备我父亲去了美国,并且不教我们韩语——我现在明白了,我的祖父作为从日据时代一路走来地人,看着他同样出生在日据时代的儿子,离开了这个他们曾经失去的国家,不向下一代教授他们曾经被禁止学习的东西(韩语)。他会感到十分的痛心,然而他的孙子们可能永远都不会理解他的心情。
评论翻译
otter_pop_n_lock
Good read.
I wished I had been able to speak to my paternal grandfather more. Despite living under the same roof since I was born, I never really talked to him all that much mainly because of the language barrier but he was always a stoic figure with a quick temper.
He passed away over 20 years ago and the little I know about him is through my dad. Apparently my grandfather had a very Japanese mentality since that's what he was brought up in. He didn't learn Korean until he was in his early 20's. He studied in China so he also spoke fluent Mandarin (I think also Cantonese). Apparently he was also came from a very wealthy family but his father gave everything to his mistress and he was left abandoned on the streets of Tokyo at a young age. He had a very difficult life but was intelligent and had an amazing work ethic. I remember seeing his desk drawer always neatly organized. He fixed everything in the house and was very frugal. The happiest I ever saw him was his last days when he was terminally ill. Too weak to move around freely he was usually on the couch watching TV when I'd come home from school and he'd smile as bright as I could remember that his grandchildren were home.
Sorry this was all sort of random.
好文章。
我希望我能多跟我祖父说几句话。尽管我从出生起就与祖父住在同一个屋檐下,但主要是因为语言上的障碍,我从来没有和他说过话,但他一直是一个性格坚韧、性格耿直的人。
他20多年前就去世了,我对他的了解都是通过我爸爸的讲述。显然,我的祖父有一种非常日本式的思维,因为他是在日据时代长大的。他直到20岁出头才学会韩语。他在中国学习过,所以他也能说一口流利的普通话(我想还有广东话)。我祖父来自一个非常富有的家庭,但我的曾祖父把所有的财产都给了他的情妇,因此我祖父在很小的时候就被遗弃在东京街头。他的生活很艰难,但他很聪明,有着惊人的道德品质。我记得他的书桌抽屉总是放得整整齐齐。他会独立修理房子里的所有东西,非常节俭。在他生命的最后几天,他才完全闲了下来。我放学回家的时候,他总是躺在沙发上看电视,因为身体太虚弱,不能自由活动。
当他看到孙子孙女都在家时,他总是笑得那么灿烂。
一时有感而发,写的有点散乱,抱歉。
Good read.
I wished I had been able to speak to my paternal grandfather more. Despite living under the same roof since I was born, I never really talked to him all that much mainly because of the language barrier but he was always a stoic figure with a quick temper.
He passed away over 20 years ago and the little I know about him is through my dad. Apparently my grandfather had a very Japanese mentality since that's what he was brought up in. He didn't learn Korean until he was in his early 20's. He studied in China so he also spoke fluent Mandarin (I think also Cantonese). Apparently he was also came from a very wealthy family but his father gave everything to his mistress and he was left abandoned on the streets of Tokyo at a young age. He had a very difficult life but was intelligent and had an amazing work ethic. I remember seeing his desk drawer always neatly organized. He fixed everything in the house and was very frugal. The happiest I ever saw him was his last days when he was terminally ill. Too weak to move around freely he was usually on the couch watching TV when I'd come home from school and he'd smile as bright as I could remember that his grandchildren were home.
Sorry this was all sort of random.
好文章。
我希望我能多跟我祖父说几句话。尽管我从出生起就与祖父住在同一个屋檐下,但主要是因为语言上的障碍,我从来没有和他说过话,但他一直是一个性格坚韧、性格耿直的人。
他20多年前就去世了,我对他的了解都是通过我爸爸的讲述。显然,我的祖父有一种非常日本式的思维,因为他是在日据时代长大的。他直到20岁出头才学会韩语。他在中国学习过,所以他也能说一口流利的普通话(我想还有广东话)。我祖父来自一个非常富有的家庭,但我的曾祖父把所有的财产都给了他的情妇,因此我祖父在很小的时候就被遗弃在东京街头。他的生活很艰难,但他很聪明,有着惊人的道德品质。我记得他的书桌抽屉总是放得整整齐齐。他会独立修理房子里的所有东西,非常节俭。在他生命的最后几天,他才完全闲了下来。我放学回家的时候,他总是躺在沙发上看电视,因为身体太虚弱,不能自由活动。
当他看到孙子孙女都在家时,他总是笑得那么灿烂。
一时有感而发,写的有点散乱,抱歉。


soyfox
Unfortunately, this is still a minority opinion in modern day Japan.
The occupation of Korea was a 'benevolent assimilation' that the inherently inferior Koreans should be grateful for.
-Japanese nationalist, 2020.
不幸的是,在现代日本,很少有人反思日本在日据时代对韩国的殖民迫害。
日本的民族主义者则认为,对朝鲜的占领是一种“善意的同化”,天性低下的韩国人应该对此心存感激。
Unfortunately, this is still a minority opinion in modern day Japan.
The occupation of Korea was a 'benevolent assimilation' that the inherently inferior Koreans should be grateful for.
-Japanese nationalist, 2020.
不幸的是,在现代日本,很少有人反思日本在日据时代对韩国的殖民迫害。
日本的民族主义者则认为,对朝鲜的占领是一种“善意的同化”,天性低下的韩国人应该对此心存感激。

articlesarestupid
Just like hwo they claim Kuril islands are theirs lol
就像他们声称千岛群岛是他们的一样
Just like hwo they claim Kuril islands are theirs lol
就像他们声称千岛群岛是他们的一样
Nukuram
I wouldn't say "Kore an should be grateful for japan," but I think the idea of "100% Japanese malice" is different.
History is complex and not simple.
I think you should stop the bad habit of being extremely aware of things.
我不会说“韩国人应该感谢日本”,但我认为“日本人对韩国做的事情不全部都是负面的”。
历史是复杂而不简单的。
我认为你应该改掉看问题走极端的坏习惯。
I wouldn't say "Kore an should be grateful for japan," but I think the idea of "100% Japanese malice" is different.
History is complex and not simple.
I think you should stop the bad habit of being extremely aware of things.
我不会说“韩国人应该感谢日本”,但我认为“日本人对韩国做的事情不全部都是负面的”。
历史是复杂而不简单的。
我认为你应该改掉看问题走极端的坏习惯。
soyfox
Japan infringed on Korea's sovereignty, and there is no ambiguity to that. Has Japan directly apologized for the annexation of Korea?
Or let me ask you, do you think the annexation of Korea by Japan was legal?
日本侵犯了韩国的主权,这一点是毋庸置疑的。日本是否为历史上直接吞并朝鲜而道歉?
或者让我问你,你认为日本吞并朝鲜是合法的吗?
Japan infringed on Korea's sovereignty, and there is no ambiguity to that. Has Japan directly apologized for the annexation of Korea?
Or let me ask you, do you think the annexation of Korea by Japan was legal?
日本侵犯了韩国的主权,这一点是毋庸置疑的。日本是否为历史上直接吞并朝鲜而道歉?
或者让我问你,你认为日本吞并朝鲜是合法的吗?
wkdbrjqnr
Japan infringed on Korea's sovereignty, and there is no ambiguity to that. Has Japan directly apologized for the annexation of Korea?
You have a very elementary understanding of ROK-Japan relations after the 1965 Normalization Treaty. Japan had tried to make amends many times, but they fell on deaf ears because the head of state in South Korea at the time were authoritarians. It's not Japan fault that the everyday Koreans hated their government/thought it was controversial. The political situation on the peninsula never really was stable enough for a period of reconciliation. The coup, the dictatorship, the student riots and the ever constant threat by Kim Il-Sung. Even as recently, LMB tried to reset ROK-Japan relations, but that was torpedoed down because of the already entrenched anti-Japanese system ingrained within Korean society. (Then he goes on a sojourn to Dokdo to 'prove' himself and wreck ROK-Japan relations even more).
Just like the pre-colonial times, too much infighting and skeletons to sort out before actually looking up to see how the world perceives itself.
Japan on the other hand has made efforts and have long gone past it. Korea's inability to sort out their shit is the cause of the ideologies that are developing in the right wing in Japan.
【日本侵犯了韩国的主权,这一点是毋庸置疑的。日本是否为历史上直接吞并朝鲜而道歉?】
你应该对1965年韩日签订关系正常化条约之后的的事情非常了解。日本曾多次试图做出弥补,但都被韩国置之不理,因为当时韩国的国家元首都是独裁统治者。韩国人讨厌他们的军政府,这不是日本的错。政变、独裁、学生骚乱和金日成的持续威胁,朝鲜半岛的政治局势从来没有真正稳定到可以进行韩日和解的程度。
李明博曾试图重启韩日关系,但由于韩国社会中根深蒂固的反日观念,这一努力被彻底摧毁。(然后李明博登上独岛,以向韩国国民“证明”自己不是亲日派,这进一步破坏了韩日关系)。
就像前殖民时代一样,韩国与其在意世界如何看待自己,不如先处理自己国内太多的内讧和丑闻。
另一方面,日本也作出了努力,而且早就过去了。韩国没有能力解决他们自己的问题,这才是日本右翼意识形态生存发展的根本原因。
Japan infringed on Korea's sovereignty, and there is no ambiguity to that. Has Japan directly apologized for the annexation of Korea?
You have a very elementary understanding of ROK-Japan relations after the 1965 Normalization Treaty. Japan had tried to make amends many times, but they fell on deaf ears because the head of state in South Korea at the time were authoritarians. It's not Japan fault that the everyday Koreans hated their government/thought it was controversial. The political situation on the peninsula never really was stable enough for a period of reconciliation. The coup, the dictatorship, the student riots and the ever constant threat by Kim Il-Sung. Even as recently, LMB tried to reset ROK-Japan relations, but that was torpedoed down because of the already entrenched anti-Japanese system ingrained within Korean society. (Then he goes on a sojourn to Dokdo to 'prove' himself and wreck ROK-Japan relations even more).
Just like the pre-colonial times, too much infighting and skeletons to sort out before actually looking up to see how the world perceives itself.
Japan on the other hand has made efforts and have long gone past it. Korea's inability to sort out their shit is the cause of the ideologies that are developing in the right wing in Japan.
【日本侵犯了韩国的主权,这一点是毋庸置疑的。日本是否为历史上直接吞并朝鲜而道歉?】
你应该对1965年韩日签订关系正常化条约之后的的事情非常了解。日本曾多次试图做出弥补,但都被韩国置之不理,因为当时韩国的国家元首都是独裁统治者。韩国人讨厌他们的军政府,这不是日本的错。政变、独裁、学生骚乱和金日成的持续威胁,朝鲜半岛的政治局势从来没有真正稳定到可以进行韩日和解的程度。
李明博曾试图重启韩日关系,但由于韩国社会中根深蒂固的反日观念,这一努力被彻底摧毁。(然后李明博登上独岛,以向韩国国民“证明”自己不是亲日派,这进一步破坏了韩日关系)。
就像前殖民时代一样,韩国与其在意世界如何看待自己,不如先处理自己国内太多的内讧和丑闻。
另一方面,日本也作出了努力,而且早就过去了。韩国没有能力解决他们自己的问题,这才是日本右翼意识形态生存发展的根本原因。
soyfox
The rise of Japanese ultra-nationalism is all Korea's fault, because everything was settled during the military dictatorship and Koreans need to stfu. What an amazing take on the situation.
In truth, Japan waited to make deals when it was beneficial, hence why it took 20 years and a coup for Japan to accept a basic normalisation treaty. Look at them scream and whine when a government that truly represents the nation is in power
你的思维真是扭曲。在你看来,日本极端民族主义的兴起都是韩国的错,因为一切都可以在韩国军事独裁时期得到解决,韩国人需要对日本闭嘴。
事实上,日本只有在觉得对自己有利的时候,才会签署条约,这就是为什么日本托了20年的时间,并趁着韩国政变内部动荡之际,才与韩国签订了日韩关系正常化条约,韩国因此被迫做出重大让步。
当真正代表韩国国家的政府掌权时,看看日本人是如何尖叫和哀嚎的。
The rise of Japanese ultra-nationalism is all Korea's fault, because everything was settled during the military dictatorship and Koreans need to stfu. What an amazing take on the situation.
In truth, Japan waited to make deals when it was beneficial, hence why it took 20 years and a coup for Japan to accept a basic normalisation treaty. Look at them scream and whine when a government that truly represents the nation is in power
你的思维真是扭曲。在你看来,日本极端民族主义的兴起都是韩国的错,因为一切都可以在韩国军事独裁时期得到解决,韩国人需要对日本闭嘴。
事实上,日本只有在觉得对自己有利的时候,才会签署条约,这就是为什么日本托了20年的时间,并趁着韩国政变内部动荡之际,才与韩国签订了日韩关系正常化条约,韩国因此被迫做出重大让步。
当真正代表韩国国家的政府掌权时,看看日本人是如何尖叫和哀嚎的。
wkdbrjqnr
Once again, you're making conjectures. The Treaty was hammered out for several years before it was made official, and even before that, the political turbulence on the peninsula made it impossible for a representative government to actually officiate relations. What happened in 1953? What happened in 1961?
I hope you realize how much you've been brainwashed into all this anti-Japan political dogcrap. Not that it matters, but if you care about Korean national security now, then actually doing productive things like solving reunification or addressing the Chinese envelopment.
你在胡说。《日韩基本条约》在正式签署前经过了数年的谈判修订,朝鲜半岛的政治动荡使得韩国代议制政府无法真正掌管两国关系。1953年发生了什么?1961年发生了什么?
我希望你意识到你被这些反日的政治狗屎宣传洗脑了多少。这并不重要,但如果你现在关心韩国的国家安全,那么请做一些有实际成效的事情,比如解决朝韩统一问题或解决中国的包围压力。
Once again, you're making conjectures. The Treaty was hammered out for several years before it was made official, and even before that, the political turbulence on the peninsula made it impossible for a representative government to actually officiate relations. What happened in 1953? What happened in 1961?
I hope you realize how much you've been brainwashed into all this anti-Japan political dogcrap. Not that it matters, but if you care about Korean national security now, then actually doing productive things like solving reunification or addressing the Chinese envelopment.
你在胡说。《日韩基本条约》在正式签署前经过了数年的谈判修订,朝鲜半岛的政治动荡使得韩国代议制政府无法真正掌管两国关系。1953年发生了什么?1961年发生了什么?
我希望你意识到你被这些反日的政治狗屎宣传洗脑了多少。这并不重要,但如果你现在关心韩国的国家安全,那么请做一些有实际成效的事情,比如解决朝韩统一问题或解决中国的包围压力。
soyfox
Before that in 1951, Japan had a hand in excluding Korea in the last minute from the San Francisco treaty, which would've entitled S.Korea with compensation as an allied nation.
And in response to the Rhee administration's demand for 2 billion dollars, Japan retorted by laying claims over Japan’s property left behind in Korea- which would've been impossible had the Treaty of San Francisco applied to South Korea (Article 14 : the Allied powers will re-possess all Japanese assets left behind in their countries).
1951年,日本在旧金山条约的最后一刻将韩国排除在外,该条约本来赋予了韩国作为盟国向日本索要补偿的权利。
为了回应李承晚英浩政府提出的20亿美元的索赔要求,日本倒打一耙,反而对日本留在韩国的财产提出了索赔。
如果韩国加入旧金山条约,那么日本是不可能提出这种无礼要求的(旧金山条约第14条:盟国将直接接管日本留在他们各自国家境内的所有资产)。
Before that in 1951, Japan had a hand in excluding Korea in the last minute from the San Francisco treaty, which would've entitled S.Korea with compensation as an allied nation.
And in response to the Rhee administration's demand for 2 billion dollars, Japan retorted by laying claims over Japan’s property left behind in Korea- which would've been impossible had the Treaty of San Francisco applied to South Korea (Article 14 : the Allied powers will re-possess all Japanese assets left behind in their countries).
1951年,日本在旧金山条约的最后一刻将韩国排除在外,该条约本来赋予了韩国作为盟国向日本索要补偿的权利。
为了回应李承晚英浩政府提出的20亿美元的索赔要求,日本倒打一耙,反而对日本留在韩国的财产提出了索赔。
如果韩国加入旧金山条约,那么日本是不可能提出这种无礼要求的(旧金山条约第14条:盟国将直接接管日本留在他们各自国家境内的所有资产)。
And the 1953 talks didn't go so well:
In a negotiation session in 1953, Hong Jin-gi, chief negotiator for Korea, requested Japan to withdraw the claim for its property, noting that Korea by then had withdrawn from making claims based on human rights violations such as massacre and slave labor and instead limited itself to claims already reduced to a monetary sum. Kubota Kanichiro, Japan’s chief negotiator retorted: “Then Japan, too, has a right for a claim: for 36 years, Japan conferred a great deal of benefit to Koreans by planting trees in Korea’s mountains, building railroads and constructing hydroelectric dams.” When the appalled Hong noted Korea could have done those things as an independent nation, Kubota went further: “Without Japan, Korea would have been a Chinese or Russian colony—and would have been in a much worse situation.” When Kubota made clear he had no intention to withdraw his comments—which came to be known as “Kubota’s Delusional Remarks” [구보타 망언] in Korea—the Korean delegation walked out.
The turning point did come in 1960 when a former Imperial Japanese army officer became the president through unlawful means.
I in progressing foward and dealing with modern issues. But I won't become a Japan apologist while doing do.
在1953年的一次谈判会议上,韩国首席谈判代表洪金基(Hong jin-gi)要求日本撤回对其财产的索赔,并指出,当时韩国已经撤回了对日本基于大屠杀和奴隶劳动等侵犯人权的大规模索赔,已经减少到仅限于货币金钱的索赔。
但日本首席谈判代表久保田宽一郎反驳说:“那么日本也有权提出索赔:36年来,日本通过在韩国的山区植树、修建铁路和修建水电大坝,给韩国人带来了巨大的利益。”当震惊的洪金基(Hong jin-gi)指出韩国作为一个独立的国家本可以做这些事情时,久保田更进一步:“如果没有日本,韩国就会成为中国或俄罗斯的殖民地-而且情况会更糟。”当久保田明确表示他无意撤回他的言论时-他的言论在韩国被称为“久保田的妄想言论”[구보타망언]。韩国也因此代表团退出了谈判。
日韩关系的转折点确实出现在1960年,但那是因为一名前日本帝国军官(朴槿惠的父亲朴正熙)通过非法手段成为了韩国总统。
我也会把目光放在当下。但是我不会在处理现实问题的同时成为日本的辩护者。
In a negotiation session in 1953, Hong Jin-gi, chief negotiator for Korea, requested Japan to withdraw the claim for its property, noting that Korea by then had withdrawn from making claims based on human rights violations such as massacre and slave labor and instead limited itself to claims already reduced to a monetary sum. Kubota Kanichiro, Japan’s chief negotiator retorted: “Then Japan, too, has a right for a claim: for 36 years, Japan conferred a great deal of benefit to Koreans by planting trees in Korea’s mountains, building railroads and constructing hydroelectric dams.” When the appalled Hong noted Korea could have done those things as an independent nation, Kubota went further: “Without Japan, Korea would have been a Chinese or Russian colony—and would have been in a much worse situation.” When Kubota made clear he had no intention to withdraw his comments—which came to be known as “Kubota’s Delusional Remarks” [구보타 망언] in Korea—the Korean delegation walked out.
The turning point did come in 1960 when a former Imperial Japanese army officer became the president through unlawful means.
I in progressing foward and dealing with modern issues. But I won't become a Japan apologist while doing do.
在1953年的一次谈判会议上,韩国首席谈判代表洪金基(Hong jin-gi)要求日本撤回对其财产的索赔,并指出,当时韩国已经撤回了对日本基于大屠杀和奴隶劳动等侵犯人权的大规模索赔,已经减少到仅限于货币金钱的索赔。
但日本首席谈判代表久保田宽一郎反驳说:“那么日本也有权提出索赔:36年来,日本通过在韩国的山区植树、修建铁路和修建水电大坝,给韩国人带来了巨大的利益。”当震惊的洪金基(Hong jin-gi)指出韩国作为一个独立的国家本可以做这些事情时,久保田更进一步:“如果没有日本,韩国就会成为中国或俄罗斯的殖民地-而且情况会更糟。”当久保田明确表示他无意撤回他的言论时-他的言论在韩国被称为“久保田的妄想言论”[구보타망언]。韩国也因此代表团退出了谈判。
日韩关系的转折点确实出现在1960年,但那是因为一名前日本帝国军官(朴槿惠的父亲朴正熙)通过非法手段成为了韩国总统。
我也会把目光放在当下。但是我不会在处理现实问题的同时成为日本的辩护者。
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